Fixed assets between main base and ABC line

[dead_man1876]

Between main base and ABC line there are fixed artillery pieces which cannot be moved. Some players did some tests and found out where to aim in order to hit these pieces without a spot. Imo this is an exploit. Is it allowed and how about having a spot at it?

[totaler_humbug]

Difficult question. In my opinion cloudspots are kind of tricky, but there is not much to proove it and prevent it. Besides from that it´s still some kind of personal skill, as you don´t use any kind of additional program.

[dead_man1876]

The question is: Is it allowed to arty fixed assets between main base and ABC line?
-------------End of map----------------
main base
---------------ABC-----------------------
Mobile or fixed arty out of sight: x

fires

-----------------ABC-----------------------
at stationary asset: x

main base: here
-------------End of map------------------

Yes or no?

[totaler_humbug]

In general it´s allowed to shoot inside the ABC-line, aslong you don´t hit an area inside the mainbase or a spawn.

Which map do you mean? Maybe that will make it easier.

[ajappat]

Atleast on Eppeldorf, US have their arty inside ABC, clearly outside mainbase.

[pureperversions]

i think to make it easyer if arty is inside abc line its considered out of bounds(eg allied artilerry eppeldorf), if arty is near a main base its considered out bounds(eg fall of tobruk axis mortars) if it is far away say nebel on eppeldorf its allowed

[dead_man1876]

OK, it is Eppeldorf.
The round just started, I went to the arty piece and asked for spots and got killed by the nebelwerfer in the same minute. The guy at the nebelwerfer continued to kill almost everyone who spawed there (he alternated the two spots and also fired in between) or who went to use arty, until I warned him because I thought that it is not allowed. Others replied that it's OK, so that's why I ask: for the next time.
Here you can see how to aim using the trees. This is no skill, anybody can do it. Now that I've posted the pic it's even more easily.
The nebelwerfer is not 100% accurate at that distance but with HE it's no problem. Just fire at and between the two positions (for people moving in between). To me it's just spawn raping with arty and an exploit. Practically you cannot destroy that arty piece with HE. It was always at full health.
The rule for the ABC line should be: if enemy fires or camps from inside you can attack it,  but not fixed gun emplacements and spawn points because of this exploit possibility (cloud/tree aiming).

[ajappat]

To be honest, I have never actually seen this happen and I have played something about 3-4 years on hslan. Same rules apply to arty as any other unit, except planes. No base rape and as forward spawns are counted as base, clearly artygun with spawn right next to it is part of this rule.

There's weird belief though, that it is ok to come destroy static positions in mainbases. Is it allowed on 762 or why do people think it's okay to baserare as long as they kill arty while doing it?

[totaler_humbug]

If he is shooting the spawn it´s not allowed.

[dead_man1876]

[quote="hslan.ajappat"]
To be honest, I have never actually seen this happen and I have played something about 3-4 years on hslan. Same rules apply to arty as any other unit, except planes. No base rape and as forward spawns are counted as base, clearly artygun with spawn right next to it is part of this rule.

There's weird belief though, that it is ok to come destroy static positions in mainbases. Is it allowed on 762 or why do people think it's okay to baserare as long as they kill arty while doing it?
[/quote]

On 762 you are not allowed either.
Personally I would say that it should not be allowed to attack anything behind ABC line. If one team shoots from inside ABC it's because the enemy is too close to it. It shoud retreat so that the others can come out and fight.
As about the argument that on Goodwood is OK to attack behind ABC because they can shoot at one exit from there I would like to reply to use the other exit for tanks and the one close to ABC for spotters or hide yourself behind it and shoot them as soon as they leave their ABC line.
Sometimes I get the impression that for some only kills count, not fair play, which makes me feel sad about it.
If firing behind ABC gets allowed, where do we stop? Should the Devs draw another line?

[ajappat]

[quote="dead_man1876"]
Personally I would say that it should not be allowed to attack anything behind ABC line. If one team shoots from inside ABC it's because the enemy is too close to it. It shoud retreat so that the others can come out and fight.
[/quote]
I think ABC line is there just to prevent enemy going further. Kinda like map borders or out of bounds area, what ever one likes to call it. It's is just stupid assumption that people would not shoot beyond some invisible line. Some FH maps really could use redoing on this part as sometimes ABC line is really close to enemy base (eppeldorf), but usually there's a lot of area between base and ABC (see hürtgen, totalize, meuse and most other maps).

[dead_man1876]

Yes, you are right. Now I remember the difference between bf42 and fh. The introduction of the abc line was a great thing. Base is where one can see emplacements and the vehicle pool, abc is what you cannot pass. I never played FH on public, I was too late. Thank you.

[Ts4EVER]

The not shooting into the abc line rule is stupid. Basically the devs put the abc line so close to flags BECAUSE you are able to shoot into it. If they didn't want you to shoot into it, they owuld have made it impossible. The only use of the abc line is keeping players from entering it, that is the only function. As far as the devs are concerned, you can shoot into it as much as you want. If they want to protect the main from that, they place terrain or objects in front of it.

[dead_man1876]

Now I understood it, I think:
Shooting over ABC line is OK in both directions.
But as ajappat says, shooting at forward spawns and assets close to and between them should be considered shooting at main base and therefore not allowed. So next time I'll kindly ask the guy at the nebelwerfer to concentrate on other spots than main base, with your permission.